Questions and Discussion points for An Apple Red As Blood

[chloris.livejournal.com]

It's time for my questions and discussion points for this week's episode. Only one more left.

1. This episode did answer some questions but it did it in a way that creates more questions. Now we know Snow didn't have any idea about Daniel until she ate the apple, so why did Snow think Regina hated her and was willing to have her killed? And killed Leopold? Most of the Snow and Charming fairybacks we've seen are pre-apple and Snow was very aware that she ruined Regina's life then.

2. And another answer which creates a question: When did Regina realize for certain Emma is "The Savior"? At the end of episode 2 when she discussed it with Mr. Gold? Because all season it has been played as Regina hating Emma for interfering with Henry not Regina fearing that Emma will break the curse and here we find out she has known for a long time.

3. This brings up the second part we learned about the curse breaking; that Emma's death will shatter the curse. Hmmm. Gold obviously knew that (and very obviously wrote that clause into the curse) which brings up the question of why he hasn't killed her? I have two possible answers. First, perhaps he doesn't want to kill her and is willing to wait a bit for her to believe instead, and, second, killing her would create an outcome he doesn't want (like everyone going back to FTL) so he has to wait. Oooh, I just thought of a third: killing Emma only breaks the curse if Regina does it since Regina cast the curse.

4. Okay, where the hell did Jefferson come from? I can see why he wouldn't volunteer to Regina that he had another hat which works (if it did) but we better get an explanation next week. Especially since I don't see where he had time to disappear in the normal way after falling two stories onto hard ground before Emma and Mary Margaret looked out of the window.

5. We now have confirmation that Jefferson's hat can travel through time as well as space. Why couldn't Rumpelstiltskin have used a dimension jumper then? It looks to me as though (with proper aim) it could have brought Rumpel right to Bae. Or did the Blue Fairy have a reason she wanted the curse to be used?

6. Gold is studying his globe and planning a trip. Where to? We know he doesn't know where Bae is (or even how old he is) or he couldn't have been fooled by August, and also the world is a BIG place. It's not as though he needs to visit a few villages or a small area. He would need a direction and I'm wondering where he is going to get one.

7. The apple is more than Regina's favorite fruit and method of destruction, it is also tied into the health of the curse. The curse seems to be sustaining the apple tree since weakening the curse weakens her tree. Does it also work in the other direction? Would cutting down the apple tree end the curse? Also, anyone having a weird craving for apple turnovers? We did see one 'kill' Henry but it looked so tasty! Nom.

8. When Regina wanted to make a new deal with Gold and he told her she had nothing he wanted I'm sure a large portion of the viewing audience said 'Belle' to the screen. Why didn't Regina pull out the Belle card then? Not desperate enough maybe? I can see it blowing up in her face quite easily and I'm sure she can too.

9. If Regina can rewrite people as she promised she would do for Jefferson, how often do you think she rewrote things in the 28 years of the curse? I'm thinking often because otherwise Storybrooke is simply too damn boring and also Evil Queens do need to have hobbies. Maybe that is why Henry was in therapy. It wasn't that nothing ever changed. It's that things did and no one remembered they were ever different. :)

10. Will Emma's kiss wake up Henry next week? True love doesn't only have to mean romantic love. It can be familial love as well. (Or as Emma was created from true love and likely written into the curse through the true love potion, perhaps her kisses always have the power of true love.) Assuming the kiss is used and works, does Emma have to believe the concept first or will the kiss work anyway and thereby trigger her belief?

11. Is Emma now at the point of still truly not believing or is she at the point of not wanting to believe? The way she talked this week gave me the impression she doesn't have the same certainty that she had before. I'm sure Henry is counting on that.

Well, that is all I have for this week! If anyone is interested in more of my thoughts on the episode, I wrote a review here.

Comments

[sparkythegeek.livejournal.com]

# 2 and 4 had me bewildered too!

Especially when Regina was suddenly IN THE KNOW about Emma being the savior! I shouted, "Hey, since when did she know?!" while watching. LOL

Jefferson's reappearance was a shock, but I was glad to see him. :D

[chloris.livejournal.com]

I can sort of see where they have teased Regina knowing about Emma but I think they mishandled the reveal. If you are going to keep something secret from the audience all season it isn't good to reveal it casually in a conversation. Oh by the way...I knew the whole time.

As for Jefferson, I would have liked to see something that indicated where he has been and how he got away in the first place. His attractiveness does cover many flaws though. :)

[sensitivinferno.livejournal.com]

1. I have my own theories about this. I think Snow might have assumed for the longest time that Regina was pissed at her for causing her to marry into a loveless marriage. Leopold was much older than Regina, and obviously still hung up on Snow's mother. Being sent to a loveless marriage bed with a much older man when she was probably a virgin at the time probably wasn't too pleasant for Regina. There is a lot of stuff one could read into that.

2. I'm pretty sure she's known ever since Gold said, "you know exactly who she is." But Emma is a very stubborn woman, and Regina has known that she doesn't believe in the curse. If the tree is dying, I feel like Emma must be starting to believe!

3. You're right, it may have to be Regina who does it. Otherwise, I could see Gold running Emma through on the first day they met, lol.

4. I feel like I'm the only person not bothered by the sudden return of Jefferson, lol. The guy has a few screws loose, I assume he ran away at the end of Hat Trick and just stayed hidden for a while. He would never disappear completely or for too long because he's too obsessed with Grace.

5. It's possible that, even with his vast knowledge, Rumple didn't know about the hat. It seems a unique and custom piece of magic. And I wouldn't put ANYTHING past the Blue Fairy!

6. He might have theorized some leads. He's a smart guy. He's just looking to put some miles on that old Caddy!

7. I thought it looked a little undercooked.

8. Yeah, I was rocking back and forth like a mental patient chanting, "here it comes!" And then...it didn't. I'm pretty sure the writers were fucking with us when Gold said, "you no longer have anything I want." They WANTED our heads to explode! Mine nearly did. Anyway, yeah, Belle is probably a last resort...if Regina is even able to keep control of her. I have some head-canon where Regina is ALWAYS the one to "reveal" Belle, but maybe that won't be the case at all. The finale looks to take place in the hospital for much of it, because of Henry. Maybe Belle uses all the excitement to escape. Maybe Gold comes by and sees a shifty nurse entering a door that says "exit" and follows her. I don't know anymore!

9. All of this. I imagine anytime someone was supposed to graduate high school or get married or apply to college, Regina has to adjust the curse. Either that, or it really was on an endless loop. And of course Henry would notice that he moved on to other grades but his classmates never did.

10. I truly think a kiss from Emma is where they're going with this. Maybe since she is the result of True Love, maybe her kisses do always work. The creators have alluded to something like that. It's just that Emma doesn't freely give out kisses, lol. Maybe if August had played his cards right, she could have kissed him and fixed his wood problem! All of the puns intended.

11. Emma is ready to believe, but it just all still seems so unbelievable. Plus she has that little problem of not wanting people to depend on her. I grew up in this world, same as Emma, and I know for damn sure I wouldn't believe that I was the Savior meant to stop some magical curse in MAINE! It's so far-fetched, I would need proof that I can't debunk. So I always kind of stick up for Emma, even when she frustrates me. Had she been able to see August's little problem, though, it would have really helped things along.

[sidhe-faerie.livejournal.com]

I so want to ship August and Emma. I'm still holding out hope for him.

[sensitivinferno.livejournal.com]

I do, too. Or at least I did. I was really disillusioned when August referred to her as "that woman" and pretty much declared that he'd been using her because of his problem. And yet, I remember the way he's LOOKED at her and I can't help but hope.

[sidhe-faerie.livejournal.com]

It's so hard to ship Emma with anyone because they all keep dying on her

[chloris.livejournal.com]

Truth. She needs someone who stays alive for at least a season! Until then she has her many and various hats to keep her warm. :)

[chloris.livejournal.com]

1. I agree that there are many reasons Snow could have assumed about Regina's enmity and I hope they are explored next year. It was quite clear that Regina was not happy with Leopold. But it did seem she knew about Daniel already!

3. Heh. He isn't much for being slow to kill people who are in his way. Either Regina must the one to do it or killing Emma breaks the curse in a way he doesn't like.

4. I like he's back but I have trouble believing he could have run from the fall so quickly. It's like the lasagna last week. *g* I'm good with suspending my disbelief on BIG things but sometimes the small ones trip me up.

5. He specifically mentions dimension jumpers to the Blue Fairy so maybe not a hat (and this hat almost certainly didn't exist back then) but he knew about the concept. I'm hoping for a Blue Fairy reveal in the finale. *crosses fingers*

7. It could have been a little browner but it still put my in mind of my own apple turnover recipe and I think I'll make it for the finale. It seems appropriate.

8. They were completely fucking with us. It couldn't have been clearer if the actors had looked at the camera and winked. It would be funny if Regina held back from using Belle all this time waiting for the right moment and then she loses Belle before she can. All the risk of Gold's reaction and none of the benefit of getting a deal out of him.

9. I do think it really was loop so Ashley was always just about to give birth, weddings were always just about to happen, graduation was always coming up. However, I love the thought of Regina rewriting Snow into various lives over the years. 'Let's see. Last year she'll have had children and lost them in a nasty divorce. This year she is a childless day care operator taking care of other people's kids. Ooh, and next year she'll be the bereaved mother whose children have died! Mwahaha!' I mean what else was there to do in Storybrooke all those years?

10. She did seem interested in the idea of kissing him but then he felt the need to play up the mysterious angle when he should have been playing up the romance angle.

[pandorasimp.livejournal.com]

1. I'm actually hoping that Snow thought it was something else. It's hard to sympathize with Regina since Snow was so young when she betrayed her, but if other things happened after to feed that anger, it would make more sense.

2. I think Regina has suspected for some time that Emma was "the savior". I think it started with episode. Seeing what she had to sacrifice in order to try get rid of Emma, I think it makes sense she didn't act until she thought she had too.

3. See 6

4. This one really annoys me. After Hat Trick that was the biggest question everyone was asking, "Where did Jefferson go?" To just have him show up with no explanation doesn't work for me. I suppose he could have gone through the hat and ended back in Storybrooke, maybe at the town limits, but I think they need to address it on the show.

5. This has been bugging me as well. IMO bringing the time travel part with the Hat just makes everything more confusing and I’m a little disappointed the writers had to go that route, but done is done. It is possible that the blue fairy lied to Rumpelstillskin about there being no other way. Also Jefferson wouldn't have been alive back then, so perhaps that route didn't exist then but did later.
Another possibility is since our world has no magic maybe the portals, hats etc can only open to places with magic.

3 & 6. My theory is Gold needs magic to find Bae, maybe not a lot but some. I think if Emma Weakens the curse magic will come to Storybrooke and allow him to locate Bae. This is why he wants the curse weakened but not broken, so he wouldn't want Emma dead. Some have suggested that there are others ways to break the curse and that part of her dying was included as a failsafe so Regina couldn't kill her.

7. I don't know if it would break the curse, but I think she is connected to the tree somehow. It maybe her source of power, although in Storybrooke she doesn't really have power, so maybe not....

8. She might have used Belle then if it was only a matter of him not wanting to help her, but he actually doesn't have the means to help her, so it would be a waste to pull her Belle card at that point.

9. I actually don't think she can re-write their history. I think she was lying to get Jefferson to help her. A rewrite would use need magic and she has none left. Also if all she had before was what she brought, then I think she would only use it as a last resort.

10. I've thought since the beginning that Emma's true love's kiss would be Henry. So yes, I think she will wake him up. What I'm hoping for is that Regina is the one who tells or asks her to do it, knowing it will save Henry.

11. I don't know if Emma will believe or not, but it would be harder to deny that Henry is telling the truth.

[missbreese.livejournal.com]

5. This has been bugging me as well. IMO bringing the time travel part with the Hat just makes everything more confusing & It is possible that the blue fairy lied to Rumpelstillskin about there being no other way.

I hadn’t considered that.

I need an episode centered around the Blue Fairy. Everything she did for Rumple originally was meant to help him and be kind but then when he was killing people and killing her fairy sisters she not only didn’t stop him (considering she’s more powerful than him) but just sort of... What? Thought “well, I could tell him that time travel is possible, make him happy and non-killy and stop him hurting hundreds of people, but... whatever. I have more important things to do.”?

Their relationship is a huge deal and it’s been skimmed over. (why, why, why did she tell no one Rumple created the curse? He was right there locked in a cell, she put him there, but she never mentioned he’d be the one with knowledge/power to stop it?!) This should have come up this season. Esp because their reluctance to makes the Blue Fairy come off as Machiavellian and borderline evil.

[sensitivinferno.livejournal.com]

I don't know that he could have stopped it, though. Not back then, from his cell. The curse was already back in Regina's possession and she was itching to enact it. It was out of his hands. He did help by telling them how the curse would eventually be broken. I think it's why he needed Emma's name so badly. What else was he to do, at that point? I'm not sure that the Blue Fairy could have changed anything by telling them.

[missbreese.livejournal.com]

The curse was already back in Regina's possession and she was itching to enact it. It was out of his hands.

That’s true. My thought process had been, “so they knew what they were dealing with” but by that point they weren’t really dealing with him at all, just the curse. It’s likely all the (useful) information he could give, he had already given.

I think I just want a lot of scenes with those two. I’m a sucker for extremely powerful chars who abuse said power (while she doesn’t really abuse it she does bust it out all the time). On so many levels do I want a showdown between them. The two most powerful people in FTL going at it? Oh yes!

[tamlover.livejournal.com]

But until Snow and Charming talked to Rumpel, there was no way for The Blue Fairy to know that Regina's curse was the same curse as the one Rumpel was working on creating. That is, of course, presuming the Blue Fairy is not omniscient, but I don't think she is.

And once they had talked to him, they knew Emma was the only way to break the curse. I can agree telling them at that point that Rumpel created it seems logical, but I don't actually see how that information could be useful to them. Still, sharing information is definitely better.

[missbreese.livejournal.com]

there was no way for The Blue Fairy to know that Regina's curse was the same curse as the one Rumpel was working on creating.

It was the Curse To End All Curses, to take them to a land without magic. If the Blue Fairy couldn’t figure it out, just from that alone, the girl needs to find a new profession.

And she would have known there was no way the Queen could create a curse that powerful (not being as young as she is and relatively new to magic. Regina’s extremely powerful, but she lacks experience) and Blue was close enough to Rumple’s life (enough so that she could pick up the pieces of the people he left behind) that she would have known he was, throughout the centuries, working on it.

But I think that, simply by knowing him and by the title of the curse (as Rumple’s the one obsessed with going to a land without magic) she would have known.

the Blue Fairy is not omniscient - Honestly, to me, that remains to be seen. We know there are things she won’t do, but we haven’t seen her break a sweat to do very, very hardcore things. She has the power, the experience, the intelligence and, to date, we’ve seen no repercussions from the magic she uses.

Really, I just look at everything Rumple can do, magnify it, and see a scary powerful girl.

[tamlover.livejournal.com]

It was the Curse To End All Curses, to take them to a land without magic. If the Blue Fairy couldn’t figure it out, just from that alone, the girl needs to find a new profession.

But Blue didn't know that (from what we saw).

Here's the exact text of what the Queen said - and I don't see a way to determine the nature of the curse (or even that there'd be a curse) from it: But you shall have it! My gift to you is this happy, happy day. But tomorrow, my real work begins. You’ve made your vows, now I make mine. Soon, everything you love, everything all of you love, will be taken from you. Forever. And out of your suffering, will rise my victory. I shall destroy your happiness, if it is the last thing I do.

All she said - is "I'm gonna take away what you love and make you suffer" - I personally do not think that is anywhere near specific enough to know it's about sending them to a world without magic, trapping them in time, or has a thing to do with Rumpelstiltskin. It's actually pretty vague and could be bandied about by a number of villains.

They only learned about the other stuff *after* speaking to Rumpelstiltskin, at which point they discovered the specifics, including the only cure.

[missbreese.livejournal.com]

The Blue Fairy wouldn’t have known what the Queen meant at the wedding, that was a vague threat. But it didn’t take long for specifics to come out and from there Blue surely must have known.

I think we’re going to have to agree to disagree. I just can’t imagine how Blue wouldn’t know what was going on and who was truly behind it.

[tamlover.livejournal.com]

If you are saying that the Blue Fairy knew Rumpel was behind it *after Snow and Charming had their conversation with Rumpelstiltskin* and told her about it, then yes, I agree that she knew then. Although I think that took a good while, since I think Charming and Snow were probably married over a year before Emma was born, and Snow was third trimester before talking to Rumpel.

By then, the curse was unstoppable. Or so they kept saying (Blue and Rumpel). And they didn't need the Blue Fairy to figure out how to break it, since Rumpelstiltskin already told them about Emma.

I still thinking killing the Queen before she could enact would have been the best idea. If only Charming had thrown that sword a few seconds earlier...

[chloris.livejournal.com]

2. Yes, it does make sense but if we had known earlier that she knew (and that she couldn't kill Emma) it would have stopped a lot of questions about whether Regina was a bit dim.

4. I'm going to be real annoyed if the finale comes and goes and we still don't know if that hat worked.

5. Another possibility is since our world has no magic maybe the portals, hats etc can only open to places with magic.

I like that idea. It doesn't preclude the Blue Fairy manipulating things but it does make sense.

7. She does have power but not independent power. Her power is through the curse where she can rewrite people's lives (apparently) and keep people from remembering. The curse power may flow through the tree.

8. We don't know if he could help just that he had no interest. But it wasn't the right for Belle since Regina had other options.

[missbreese.livejournal.com]

2. It makes sense to me that she would have figured it out, but that’s a scene the writer’s should not have cut. It’s a huge deal that she knows.


3. I don’t think Rumple and the Queen are as trigger happy as they sometimes appear. They both know the value of patience (and Rumple takes patience to a ridiculous extreme. I don’t think it kills him to wait Emma out. And, of course, he probably has a hundred plans for her.)

I don’t think everyone necessarily goes back to FTL when it breaks. I have no idea what will happen, but Gold’s making arrangements for our world. I’m sure his plans are going to come down to all those FTL trinkets he’s surrounded by. Perhaps he’ll simply have the power to say, ‘Whatevs on everyone going back to FTL, I’ve created a new curse solely placed on myself so that I stay.’


5. I’m curious about this too. Was he simply taking Blue’s words as 100% truth, that nothing but a curse could get him there or could the hat not go to a place without magic, or...?

It just looks really stupid that this guy who’s extremely clever, powerful and desperate wouldn’t see something so simple. You’d think he’d exhaust all resources before (or while) creating a curse that took centuries to perfect.

Along with Regina knowing Emma’s the Savior they should have added more dialogue with the hat. A quick line on ‘it won’t let you go to a land without magic’ or something would have done wonders.


6. I know! And Bae probably doesn’t have the same name (I mean... who would keep a name like that in our world?) so it’s not like Google is going to be a great help.

Emma might, because she’s not too shabby finding people, but even that is stretching it. “I need to find someone. He probably has brown hair, unless he dyed it. Blue eyes. No idea how old. Might be going by ‘Baelfire,’ and could be absolutely anywhere in the world. I’m confident this is enough information for you.”


8. Agreed. Unless Jefferson immediately popped into her head as a good alternative, but it didn’t look like she considered that while in Gold’s shop. At least to me. (I also boggled me that she was walking around FTL trinkets liek woah and didn’t snag some on her way out.)

I just think losing everything she worked for would have been enough. If losing Henry isn’t enough to fork over Belle I’m gonna take back all the words I said on Regina being a good mother. Gold would have the information, if not the power, to help with that one. She better exhaust all resources.

...I have a soft spot for Mommy!Regina :)


10. Probably. But I don’t like it.

[chloris.livejournal.com]

2. Yes! I feel cheated of a reaction scene!

3. Heh, perhaps not and especially in Storybrooke when killing people isn't as easy to get away with. And that's a good point about having many plans for Emma. There is still the favor she owes him after all.

5. Unless once he focused on the curse he stopped considering other options. Making the curse seems to have taken centuries of concerted effort and dedication. It would be rather amusing if he got played though.

8. What will she be willing to do to save Henry, that is the question! Give up Belle? I could see it but she better have an escape plan. Allow Emma to believe? I can see that too but that would mean putting Henry above her revenge and I'm not sure if she could. She has spent so long planning this and was willing to kill her father for it as well as give up Daniel's ring.

10. Why not? Emma's belief is what the series has been building to and kissing Henry awake is too big for her to ignore.

[missbreese.livejournal.com]

10: Because True Love's Kiss has always been for romance purposes. It's ridiculous, to me, to change that now so that it fits 'any love at all, platonic or romantic.'

[chloris.livejournal.com]

Makes sense. It doesn't bother me so I'm okay with the idea. However, I wonder if Emma herself IS true love and therefore her kisses will break curses no matter her feelings of romantic love for the person. (Though she cared for Graham and was attracted to him I don't see him as her true love and yet her kiss worked on him.)

[missbreese.livejournal.com]

I wonder if Emma herself IS true love and therefore her kisses will break curses no matter her feelings of romantic love for the person. - I can’t tell if that’s cheesy or ten shades of hardcore awesome!

Probably the latter. I mean, a kissing booth would be kinda weird, but I would love to see Emma have this sort of power.

[tamlover.livejournal.com]

#1 - Major problem for me. It introduces an entirely unnecessary element of the new lie - a life-ruining event that Snow is responsible for that keeps Regina from ever having true love that isn't Daniels' death - that Snow has to believe. It would have been much simpler to do what we all thought all along and have her learn about Daniel's death somewhere along the way. Maybe it'll play out to a good story, but I'm not that optimistic at the moment.

#4 - Yes, please, I want that addressed

#5 - Right now, I still believe the Blue Fairy. But I think even introducing time travel was a bad idea. Unless the rules are well-thought-out in advance, or it's a one-off, time travel really had the likely outcome of muddying the waters and creating confusion and plot-holes

#7 - I think everyone saw that coming except me. I always thought the apple tree was just symbolic. Though it does make Emma taking a chainsaw to it funnier.

#9 - Regarding Regina re-writing things. Well, I had suspected she did with the Kathryn Nolan/John Doe thing, but we never heard of it, so I guess that idea is probable again. Also, people have complained the world isn't hellish enough for a curse: maybe it used to be until Regina wanted a more wholesome environment to raise a child in? :D Honestly though, I don't think the entire world kept getting re-written - beyond the confusingness of it (for the audience), I'm not sure Regina really has enough magic available to her to do that.

#10 - Though it's predictable, anything except a kiss being what saves Henry would probably be disappointing at this point.

[chloris.livejournal.com]

1. Not necessarily if Regina had admitted she blamed Snow for Daniel leaving then Snow could believe she knew the truth and that she was responsible for ruining Regina's life and that belief would stem from the same incident. However, I would not mind if there was MORE to it. It works as a root cause but it's rather weak as the sum total reason for Regina's hatred.

5. She may have been truthful at the time but they have created the question. (And even if not truthful her motives may be good ones - FTL seems to be running out of power and a radical solution could be necessary.) As for time travel, they did already introduce it by having the curse travel both time and space though the fine tuning of connecting the lands is new.

7. Heh. Regina should have FREAKING out a lot more than she was.

9. I don't know how easy it is to rewrite things (assuming she really can) and changing everything around frequently would be annoying. But rewriting Mary into various bad/sad/depressing lives would have been quite fun for Regina so I can see that.

[tamlover.livejournal.com]

1.Now for there being more to the story than Snow spilling the beans and Cora killing Daniel - I'm adamantly against that. It would be a retcon of the highest order. Both when she spoke to the Huntsman and when she spoke to Snow before Snow ate the apple, Regina explicitly said the reason for her hatred of Snow was secret-spilling. Regina is most definitely not the type to downplay the wrong done against her, for Snow to have done something more major does not make sense. Some smaller fights and disagreements along the way are okay, but she cannot have done anything really worse, because if she had, Regina would have mentioned it, rubbed her face it. And I still cannot figure out what Snow was told (if she did not know of Daniel's death) that makes her think *she's* the one responsible for Regina never being able to have love again.

5.Actually, I didn't like that time-travel thing brought up with Bae, either, but at least that was limited to the *last* bean and the big bad curse. It's not something that's really *available* to people. Once time travel becomes available, you have the question of *why aren't they using it*? I will say I don't think Rumpel could have used that sort of time travel, anyway, because Regina had to know the specifics of when and where (I thought?), and he wouldn't have known that. I don't think the Blue Fairy could've done it either, but am less certain there.

9. Did Jefferson say nothing had changed in 28 years? If he did, then probably either nothing he was aware of changed (and I don't know if he'd have been watching Mary Margaret), or else he was magically unaware of changes. I have to admit, magic or no, I don't know why Regina let Mary Margaret be Henry's teacher. If she really thinks Snow is that wretched a person, she shouldn't want her child around Snow.

[chloris.livejournal.com]

1. Sorry, I don't agree at all but then I'm fine with additions to the story that weren't there in first place so long as they don't contradict. The secret spilling and the death of Daniel may be the MOST IMPORTANT reasons for her to hate Snow as well as the root and central cause but there is nothing said that it has to be the sum total of the story. I doubt it can be worse than causing the end of True Love but I'm fine with something else in their past being bad enough that Snow at least could think that was the problem.

9. Perhaps Regina enjoyed rubbing it in Mary Margaret's face that she had a child while Mary did not? And I'm sure it was fun to sneer at Mary whenever Regina needed to visit the classroom.

[tamlover.livejournal.com]

We'll just have to disagree. To me, adding something worse that Snow did in the past is like having a show where Jill hates Ann and says the reason for her hatred is Ann stole her high school boyfriend. Even tells Ann that right before she tries to kill her. Then next season it's revealed Jill also knew that Ann also killed Jill's brother, and that's why she really hates her. It just doesn't make sense.