Episode Discussion 1x15: Red-Handed

[jadestrick.livejournal.com]

Posting a bit early as I'll be out this evening. Y'all enjoy the episode!



Episode Discussion 1x15: Red-Handed

After quitting Granny’s diner and with her self-esteem at an all-time low, Ruby is hired by Emma to be her assistant in order to help her discover what she's good at in life. Emma continues questioning David about the disappearance – and possible murder – of Kathryn. Meanwhile, in the fairytale land that was, Red Riding Hood yearns to run away with her true love. But she, along with her fellow townspeople, are virtual prisoners when a bloodthirsty wolf continues on its relentless killing spree.

Comments

[moon-blitz.livejournal.com]

Well. I wasn't expecting that. Solid episode all around, and it was a very interesting take on the Red Riding Hood story.

[rionarch.livejournal.com]

That moment when you realized you missed the episode because of DST.

[veracity]

Holy banana cakes. This is show is all about ripping and changing the different takes.

[liltipsyfyi.livejournal.com]

wow did not see that at all! I feel so bad for Red! Also what does this mean for Ruby? She still has part of her wolfness but can she still transform in Storeybrooke? So I guess there is still more to Ruby's/Red's story :D

hmmm we know Regina keeps hearts so did someone steal one from her?

[veracity]

I wonder if Red wolves out and doesn't know about it. Or if one of the wolves in the forest, the one Graham knew, is Ruby's wolf half trying to merge.

I'm assuming that Regina has Katherine locked up, like Belle, and used one of her hearts to distract the sheriff and justice system.

[liltipsyfyi.livejournal.com]

nice catch! That would be really cool if Ruby was the Storybooke wolf! I wanna know more about Were!Ruby XD

But surely they will test it and find out that it is not Katherine's and then people will start looking for a heart hoarding killer instead of Katherine. So wouldn't that be bad for Regina?

[veracity]

It would really be neat if Ruby was the wolf. Remember the red eye it had? I think it means something.

Well, it may look bad...but not on Regina. After all, no one knows she has the hearts. It would make Emma look terrible, though. Imagine Regina, "there's a serial killer on the lose, and Sheriff Swan is unable to apprehend a single suspect." It would go very far in destroying Emma town credibility, swinging things back Regina's favor. And Regina is a creature of power, and the stability she sees it having.

[liltipsyfyi.livejournal.com]

I'm sorry for being such a fangirl but the first thing that I thought after reading your post was: GrahamxRuby

ok now that I can think straight XD

True it does make Emma look bad but it means the hunt is on for the heart hoarder and we know Emma won't rule Regina out. Also I wouldn't be surprised if Mr.Gold knows about Regina's heart hoarding.

[veracity]

I like Graham/Ruby, now that there's more back story with her. I bet they did the flirting dance in front of Granny, you know she did anyway. Anything to annoy her grams.

Well, we all know Regina is all kinds of evil, but the town is still very afraid of her. So they wouldn't really rock that boat. What if the town doesn't think it's a heart hoarder, but a message? The symbolic nature of not having your heart would be disturbing, but especially if you've given it away and it's then been stolen. Which is basically what a bad break up is.

Emma and Gold will know, but Gold has a lot less power since he gave away his true name and Emma will be under tight scrutiny.

[liltipsyfyi.livejournal.com]

Good points, especially since the finger is being pointed at Mary Margaret. After tonight's episode I'm going to say the heart was planted by some we're not expecting (ie Regina, Gold) just 'cause these writers are crazy and it's more fun that way! XD So it's totally going to be Henry ;P

[veracity]

And with the finger pointed at the mistress, of sorts. What will be interesting is if Motorcycle Author Man helps expose Regina. I think there's a lot of stuff under there to find out.

What if the person who does something is like Pinocchio?

[madwitch58.livejournal.com]

Holy what ever the hell I SO DID NOT SEE THAT COMING. sorry for shouting but I am so stoked right now.

[ye-olde-geek.livejournal.com]

I was really thinking Granny would be the wolf ('cause she's kind of a crabby old dame), so I was half-right. Didn't expect Red to be the werewolf though. Interesting take.

Oh, and I loved that it was "Peter and the Wolf" in a manner of speaking.

[pwalkeri.livejournal.com]

Oh, and I loved that it was "Peter and the Wolf" in a manner of speaking.


O.O

[ye-olde-geek.livejournal.com]

I thought her beau's name was Peter. Am I remembering that wrong?

[zippytheavenger.livejournal.com]

I loved this episode. Loved it. This one definitely made up for last week.

TIME FOR THOUGHTS

-Holy shit, finally some focus on Red and Granny. Lord&Lady, I have been wanting this since episode one.
-"You dress like Norman Bates, when he dresses like Norman Bates's mother!" ILU RUBY.
-"I should be having adventures with lemurs!" ILU SO VERY MUCH.
-That red cloak. Is. Gorgeous.
-I love the idea of Granny as a tough, overprotective old shitkicker with a crossbow.
-I do not love the idea of Peter. Really, show? Why wasn't wanting to get out and see the world enough motivation for Red? What about saving her town and being a hero? Why was Peter necessary? Why can't there ever be a woman on tv who has a goal other than Twoo Wuv?
-This episode was so well-written in terms of dialogue, probably the best yet.
-Red's costumes are amazing and I want them all. Clunkly boots, black leather pants, slouchy sweater, bright red beret? WONDERFUL.
-Something about Ruby reminds me of Chiana from Farscape. This is an excellent thing.
-I loved the scene of Ruby and Henry chilling together in the Sheriff's office. One thing about this show is they never really show any of the characters in their 'down time', which is unfortunate because you can get across some really great character information that way, and it's just fun for me to watch. This show does not have enough scenes of people just sitting around, shooting the shit.
-Great acting in this episode, especially when Ruby found the box-O-heart and peeked inside. That was a good reaction.
-Red, Snow, and Granny had a really good mother/maiden/crone vibe going, IMO. I know Snow isn't literally a mother (yet) but she does have a mature, 'motherly' kind of way about her.
-Holy moly, did this show actually show us blood? And gore? And peoplechunks? Nice!
-"I'll just screw it up. I'll probably screw it up with flair, but..." RUBY I WILL LOVE YOU UNTILL THE END OF TIME.
-Granny's creepy-ass story, immediate cut to, "Wow, your grandma's kind of intense." LOL FOREVER.
-I like the idea of Red being a werewolf, and getting it from her mum who got it from Granny. Let's see, she started wolfing out at thirteen, Granny had it but then lost it due to old age, the wolfing comes once a month at full moon and is referred to as "wolf time", it is the reason Gran keeps her closely sheltered and won't let her hang out with boys...hmmm...what could this possibly be a metaphor for?
-My one complaint is how the episode ended. I really wanted for Ruby to stay with Emma so they could solve mysteries and have adventures together (and so we could see more of Ruby because I LUFF her). I get how finding a peoplechunk in a box buried in the woods would freak anybody out, but I am disappointed that they built up Ruby's great detecting skills and desire to branch out and see more of the world only to stick her right back in the diner, contrite and vowing that she no longer wants to go anywhere or have adventures. Let's hope she changes her mind in the future, sometime soonish.
-I think this is my favorite episode, and Robert Carlyle wasn't even in it for a second. Wow.
-NEXT WEEK'S EPISODE. ARE WE FINALLY GOING TO FIND OUT WHAT THE HELL REGINA'S DAMAGE IS? IS SNOW WHITE SECRETLY A BLOODTHRISRTY PSYCHO LIKE I ALWAYS THOUGHT CHARMING WAS? I HAVE MANY QUESTIONS.

[icki-akki.livejournal.com]

Well, she is her grandma. She's family, right? So she's probably more likely to forgive.

[liltipsyfyi.livejournal.com]

I do not love the idea of Peter

I felt the same way as well! I wanted Ruby to be badass because she wanted to be, not for a guy. But I think there is going to be major development for her character since she ended up killing her twu luv. Girl's got depth. XD

I really wanted for Ruby to stay with Emma so they could solve mysteries and have adventures together

IKR!? Ruby would have been great partner for Emma, especially for bounty hunter stuff Emma does. I could understand Ruby putting travel plans to side for a while but she pretty much said she never wants to leave the diner again T-T

Holy moly, did this show actually show us blood? And gore? And peoplechunks? Nice!
This episode made me realize that this show is so not a kids show XD Like the body parts and Red eating her twu luv. Not that I'm complaining, it's pretty sick in a good way!

[nikki4noo.livejournal.com]

I like the idea of Red being a werewolf, and getting it from her mum who got it from Granny. Let's see, she started wolfing out at thirteen, Granny had it but then lost it due to old age, the wolfing comes once a month at full moon and is referred to as "wolf time", it is the reason Gran keeps her closely sheltered and won't let her hang out with boys...hmmm...what could this possibly be a metaphor for?

Considering any young girl wearing red in a fairy tale was a metaphor for sexual awakening, it was pretty damn obvious. I did like the twist of making her a werewolf and combining it with menstrual cycle.

Red Riding Hood was basically all about don't out to the woods with the young boys, you will come to a bad end.

The Snow Queen also uses an item of red clothing. In this case, shoes on Gerta. By Gerta giving up her shoes to the river, she is turning her back on becoming a woman and staying a child in order to get back her best friend and love. That story is about how childish love is a more pure form of love.

[zippytheavenger.livejournal.com]

If there's a Red Riding Hood adaption (aimed at adults), it touches on the subject of menstruation and female sexuality. I think this was done to best effect in The Company of Wolves. Ginger Snaps too, though it had nothing to do with RRH and was a straight-up werewolf movie.

[veracity]

I do not love the idea of Peter. Really, show? Why wasn't wanting to get out and see the world enough motivation for Red? What about saving her town and being a hero? Why was Peter necessary? Why can't there ever be a woman on tv who has a goal other than Twoo Wuv?


I don't know. Ruby was young in the story, right? She's young, in love, sensual, unsure of her place...I can see Peter being an important element. Most first loves are. The hard part is moving on when they've destroyed your faith. Look at Snow White and Charming's alter egos and how they've reacted to first loves. Bad decisions made, and the good, but the bad have set up the town to hate The Other Woman. The same woman that had been a beloved, accepted teacher.

I think the better question is what will Red do without her True Love's availability? This isn't like the other stories because she literally ate the love of her life, consumed him in all ways possible.

[zippytheavenger.livejournal.com]

I'm not saying that Peter's contribution to Red's glorious undoing wasn't interesting or handled well, I just wonder at the fact that in this show, everyone's backstory revolves around a love story. Hell, even Grumpy! Well, with the notable exception of Jiminy Cricket. Truly this demonstrates great skill in the writers, to be able to write the same damn thing over and over without falling asleep at their chairs. I just wish that the characters weren't so limited by this. Don't they have any other goals? Don't the want anything else? It's repetitive and boring.

I think believing that Peter was Red's "True Love" is a bit generous. They had, what, two scenes together before his untimely mauling? When did they ever hang out? How well did they know each other? Peter was a guy that Red liked and was attracted to. It could have developed into a deeper feeling if she hadn't eaten him alive, but I guess we'll never find out.

[ye-olde-geek.livejournal.com]

I think the repeated love theme may be a result of the fairy tale motif. Our modern society is a little cynical and jaded on the concept but they're a mainstay of fairy-tales, fables, and myths.

That said, I would like to see the show explore non-romantic love. The writers sort of dance around it with Emma and Henry, but the concept of brotherly/friendly love or familial love would be a welcome change.

[zippytheavenger.livejournal.com]

If there emerges any conclusive evidence to support the notion that this show's obsession with Twoo Wuv is an intentional thematic choice influenced by the fairy tale motif, then I will shut my mouth about it. Well, no, I won't, because I'll think it's a stupid and limiting decision, but yeah. Until the emergence of such evidence, I will call bullshit every time. Especially with stuff like Little Red Riding Hood, or that steaming pile of stupid with Grumpy. My objection isn't to the presence of the gooey romance at all, it's the gooey romance being needlessly crammed in where it doesn't belong for whatever reason, be it laziness or just a dearth of better ideas.

[thetaet.livejournal.com]

-Something about Ruby reminds me of Chiana from Farscape. This is an excellent thing.

Now that you mention it, I see that too! :)

-Holy moly, did this show actually show us blood? And gore? And peoplechunks? Nice!

LOL. Kind of glad my 7 year old didn't get to watch with me this time.

[hughville.livejournal.com]

Amazing episode! I was totally unprepared for the twist in Red's story. I just hope we get to see more of Meghan Ory. She is an amazing actress.

I think this is one of the best episodes yet (of course I say that about all of them until a new one airs).

[illiriahrising.livejournal.com]

Overall, I liked the episode and I loved the Ruby/Red character study we got, (sucks about her sweet love, though) but the whole Katherine is missing & Mary-Margaret is a suspect storyline is REALLY ticking me off. Have the writers (as well as Emma) forgotten that Mary-Margaret has an alibi for the night Katherine went missing? While Katherine was driving her car off the road, Mary-Margaret was at home...with Emma...crying into her pillow over David all night. Apparently, David's amnesia is catching, since no one in Storybrooke seems to remember that. Can't people that write TV just occasionally watch their own show & maybe take notes?

[veracity]

To be fair, it might be difficult with Emma being Mary Margaret's alibi. It sets up a really, really good smear campaign for Regina in regards to Emma's priorities and preferences. We all know Regina has hers, and will kill on whim if they're disturbed, but the rest of the town is already scared of Regina. So putting Emma as the bad guy gives citizens the chance to back Reg without feeling like they're betraying themselves or their compasses. Reg has done a good job of creating doubt in the eyes of the town, with the kid playground area.

As a complex layer, it definitely will divide the town on supporters. Something I bet that happened in Snow's world, too. Good parallels, really.

[litlover12.livejournal.com]

Icon love!

[bm-shipper.livejournal.com]

Blood? Body Parts? The people who provided the DL I was watching must have cut that out, because I definitely was wondering till the end what it was that Ruby found in this box... I'm from Austria, so I have to download the episodes, and in my file I saw Ruby finding this box, opening it and screaming, and then back at the Sheriff's office, I also saw "only" the box and not what's inside and definitely no blood O____O Strange... The first time I "found out" what aws inside the box and what they found was when Emma told David and Mary Margret that she found a human heart... but well... at least I got to see the episode ;)

[celestialdescent]

I think the blood and body parts others are referring to are the remains from the wolf's massacre. They didn't show the human heart on the TV here either, so you didn't miss anything.

[bm-shipper.livejournal.com]

Yeah, right! Silly me... I almost forgot about that *lol* :D Sorry :D my mistake XD

[d-garmo71.livejournal.com]

Just finished it. Loved it!

Red finding out she was the wolf and that she killed Peter (and now I have the music for Peter and the wolf stuck in my head) was heartbreaking.

Granny is badass. Expected her to be the wolf for a while there. Guess I wasn't completely wrong.

David running through the woods reminded me of Graham and I was fully expecting to see ~that wolf show up.

The one thing I didn't like was Ruby running back to the diner so quickly. I expected her to go back - Granny's not getting any younger - but I was hoping she would work with Emma for a while longer and experience some more independence.

And maybe I'm looking for things but did any notice the library being in full shot? Belle's future job if she ever gets out of her cell?

[d-garmo71.livejournal.com]

About the metaphor. If it was for the menstrual cycle than how was Granny marked and turned by her grandfather? Sexual abuse?

I'm a little confused by that. Even went back to see if she said grandmother but nope. She really does say grandfather.

[emmy-scarlet.livejournal.com]

I thought Granny was referring to Red's grandfather, since I believe in the context of the conversation Red was who was the topic. Meaning the whole marking and turning thing was, in essence, a way of the wolf (a.k.a. Red's Grandpa) to claim Granny as his mate.

But I've only watched the episode once so far, so I could have heard it wrong. But that's what I took away from it.

[d-garmo71.livejournal.com]

I just watched that scene again and you are right. It was Red's grandfather, not Granny's.

Interesting idea about the wolf claiming Granny. Hadn't thought about it like that. But that still doesn't explain how men can be werewolves, too if it's a metaphor for 'that time of the month'.

[thetaet.livejournal.com]

Interesting nod to "Peter and the Wolf".

Also, anyone else wonder if the "wizard" Granny bought the red cloak from was Rumple?

[icki-akki.livejournal.com]

I think one of the reasons Red returns to the diner is the curse, since it limits people and makes them afraid of leaving Storybrooke. Red's fear of trying new things may be related to this, as well. Because even Katherine described an irrational fear of leaving Storybrooke.

That said, great episode! I think this one greatly makes up for last week's, which, while I thought it was cute, was a little bit too contrived and strange for me. It was the dwarves coming from eggs part. Really, eggs? Okay.

Also, I always thought that this story would be one of the most interesting. Glad to say I was not disappointed.